The Dilution of our Heros

[Marcodian Elite]

Just voicing a thought that crept into my mess of a brain, It seems that the further along the series we go, our respective fable hero's powers seems to be getting diluted down in each installment. I'm judging this from what seems to be our control over magic, now I havn't played the original Fable ( or the Lost Chapters, I never owned an xbox and my first experience was with Fable 2, a game I enjoyed so much it was the first game I bought D.L.C. for, .....what also may have twisted my arm was that I found out in Knothole Island you could ressurrect your dog lol ), so I mitened be 100% correct here with this conspiracy lol.
But a quick search on google showed me that there are a vast deal more spells in fable/tlc than what was in fable 2, then the transition from fable 2-3 we lost the ability of slow time and summon creatures, not only this but we also lost the ability to harness the powers of will on our own, in fable 3 we need a gauntlet/s before we can use any powers of will ( however from this we can combine two spells but who knows if previous masters of will couldn't do the same? ) .
So I'm using the above scenario and using it to describe our heros Strength and Skill attributes, Our hero in fable 3 will be of no match to his hero parent in these 3 respective attributes ( if not for the reasoning that I've describe where-by he is all-round weaker but because he will of been less developed in these arts than his parent who - as we know from Fable 2 - was developing these skills from no age atal where as our hero in fable 3 was into adult hood before he started to fully develop the powers of Strength,Skill,Will - granted we are shown that the hero had training in the castle of sword and pistol and perhaps it was only will that was left un-nurtured but life in the castke is much cosier than the life of his parent ), and from the same cloth we can gather that the hero of fable 2 was no comparison of the great hero from the original Fable.
The slow weakness of the heros can perhaps be attributed to the destruction of the Hero's Guild, and the scarcity of any heros as the land becomes more industrialized.

I actually came up with a comparison for this in the star wars series ( no i'm not a crazy star wars fan with mountains of memorabilia, I'm not even a fan of the films tbh, I watched them as friends loved them and I gave them a chance, same reason I watched 3 horrible seasons of heros because of the potenital for a great series.....i've refused to watch any more )

But bear with me -

We have a great time of Hero's roaming the land in abundance

We have a great time of Jedi roaming the land in abundance


We have the destruction of the Hero's Guild and the slow deterioration of hero's arising

We have the destruction of the Jedi Temple and the slow deterioration of jedi arising

We have our hero in a world devoid of heros to come and save the day, he/she is a hero in his/her own right, but in comparison of hero's of old, is paltry in comparison

We have our jedi ( luke ) in a world devoid of jedi's to come and save the day, he is a jedi in his own right, but in comparison of jedi of old, is paltry in comparison

Mainly due to the proper lack of training that takes years to master but is thrust upon them in a ever meager time.



I wrote far more than I had anticipated lol, but does anyone else agree that our hero seems to be getting weaker in comparison as the franchise goes on?

 

[Pikpik]

I'm not seeing much of a discussion here...

Also, I'm pretty sure I could take any character from Fable TLC with my Fable II character... but that's just me... lol

I would agree with you though, but not in all aspects. Will, there is no doubt in my mind that these powers are being weakened from generation to generation (unless you want to count unlimited mana as strengthening the will power). I do on the other hand believe skill and strength has increased through the generations. In Fable II and Fable III, gun play was enhanced dramatically and I think if my Fable II character was given a bow or cross bow, he could still give hell in Fable TLC. Physique, I don't have much on this besides remembering my Fable TLC character couldn't hold certain weapons at 0 strength while the other two heros could hold any hammer or axe in the very beginning.

 

[Marcodian Elite]

No there's not much discussion :-( lol. Unlimited mana is powerful enough in-its self agreed, but overall the skill seems to be lessened hero-hero.

See I havnt played Fable or Tlc so I couldnt really comment much on that, just did a quick browse :-/ - anyone else played both and could comment?

As for the using of certain weapons - I think that as in Fable 3 we only see our hero as an adult whos had some form of combat training I dont think he can be compared to TLC becasue of this, we dont know if as a child he was able to wield the larger weapons, but I'm pretty sure that as he doesnt seem to have had any actual fighting of beasts etc until hes an adult that the Hero/s of Fable, TLC and Fable 2 character would have enough experience and be able to best him, but i could be wrong.

The hero from Fable 2 we see as a child and know his capabilities of combat and mabey his sword play ( and you say his skill as well ) is better than that of the TLC or Fable hero.
Thanks for taking an interest and replying.

 

[Kuld von Reyn]

I can't help but wonder if the decline of magic, like in Arcanum, stems from the rise of technology. Perhaps the reliance on machines and science stunts the growth of magic? We may have learned to combine spells in Fable 3, but we rely on gauntlets to channel our magical power, while Hobbe mages rely on their special staves.

...The exception being the Saker-type mercenary leaders. Since they also seem to grow larger than most humans, the only logical explanation is that they are time travelling heroes from the past who have been brainwashed on orders by Logan to do his bidding; the only problem being that they all went rogue and joined mercenary bands when let lose.

But yeah, while our ability to destroy things using willpower and kill things spectacularly with ranged weapons have increased, our ability to grow into lumbering giants with the ability to stop time and summon beasts from the netherworld without drinking has decreased. That's civilization for you.

 

[Marcodian Elite]

Kuld - It is hinted at in "The order of the balverines" that the rise in technology is indeed the cause ( or one of ) of magic diminishing in Albion.

Time travelling heros would be some awsome DLC now wouldnt it :steve: lol.

 

[Cain]

I can't help but wonder if the decline of magic, like in Arcanum, stems from the rise of technology. Perhaps the reliance on machines and science stunts the growth of magic? We may have learned to combine spells in Fable 3, but we rely on gauntlets to channel our magical power, while Hobbe mages rely on their special staves.

...The exception being the Saker-type mercenary leaders. Since they also seem to grow larger than most humans, the only logical explanation is that they are time travelling heroes from the past who have been brainwashed on orders by Logan to do his bidding; the only problem being that they all went rogue and joined mercenary bands when let lose.

But yeah, while our ability to destroy things using willpower and kill things spectacularly with ranged weapons have increased, our ability to grow into lumbering giants with the ability to stop time and summon beasts from the netherworld without drinking has decreased. That's civilization for you.

Of course, your explanation just so happens to be the most logical one, how convinient. Wouldn't it be easier to assume that the Game Developers thought it would be fun to add more of the mercenary leaders after Saker so it wasn't just normal mercs, and that in the games canon, Saker is the only one the hero of brightwall encounters. And besides, how would they brainwash the heroes, and how would the heroes time travel.

 

[Kuld von Reyn]

how would they brainwash the heroes

The Hypnotoad of Hook Coast is a retainer of Logan.

and how would the heroes time travel.

Daemon Doors=TARDIS, and since the TARDIS is a time machine, so are Daemon Doors. Can't argue against such amazing logic.

Seriously though, the second paragraph in my previous post was intended as a joke. I should probably add that my answers to your questions above fall within that category as well.

 

[atlantiantokra]

Daemon Doors=TARDIS, and since the TARDIS is a time machine, so are Daemon Doors. Can't argue against such amazing logic.

yeah, both are dimensionally transcendental but that 's about it, if a demon door is a time machine because of that then my house should be able to do 70mph because it's got a door

 

[Marcodian Elite]

Actually if they created 2 deamon doors in different eras/time periods, and walking through one brought you to the other time period that would be pretty awsome, and then as lionhead are big into what you do affects your kingdom, they could throw in DLC where you go back ( through the worm-hole deamon door) to a previous time period ( fable 1,2 or anywhere in between ) and your actions back then could shape how your current kingdom is, i.e. you could do something to stop the destruction of Oakvale and travel back through the deamon door to your own time period and it would appear as a new destination as it would never have been destroyed

etc ( I know this started out as a joke but how cool would this be ).

 

[atlantiantokra]

Actually if they created 2 deamon doors in different eras/time periods, and walking through one brought you to the other time period that would be pretty awsome, and then as lionhead are big into what you do affects your kingdom, they could throw in DLC where you go back ( through the worm-hole deamon door) to a previous time period ( fable 1,2 or anywhere in between ) and your actions back then could shape how your current kingdom is, i.e. you could do something to stop the destruction of Oakvale and travel back through the deamon door to your own time period and it would appear as a new destination as it would never have been destroyed ^_^ etc ( I know this started out as a joke but how cool would this be ).

or better yet have it so fable 4's hero is a descendent of the hero of brightwall and creatures of darkness are reclaiming the world and the only way to save it is to go into the past and rewrite key events in Albions history such as the destruction of the heroes guild or the (assumed) death of the Hero of Oakvale (obviously with good and bad ways of doing it, and hopefully some neutral or morally ambiguous ways as well)

and seeing as i'm on a roll typing, there was a thread about customisation how about instead of massive defence bonuses for various armour have other more unique bonuses like mage gloves give a slight increase in fireball damage, highwayman hat increases money gained from loot, balverine costumes makes it take a second or two longer for balverines to attack etc. (because I think the point of removing them in the first place was so that everybody chose thier own style rather than wearing the most powerful armour, if every piece of armour gives a completely different bonus then people will choose the ones that suit them best)

edit: I've just thought of one possible advantage to having time travel, it should make it harder to exploit the real estate system, making money based choices more difficult [although there should be a better way of making money rather than the tediousness of jobs, realistic yes, fun **** *** *** ******, I want ***** *** *** **** if I ****** ** ** **** ******* ********** ***** I would *** ***** job *** ********** ******** (I feel I should just point out, in case some smegger wants to complain, that most of that last bit was blanked out for humourous effect rather than covering a large chain of swear words)

 

[Marcodian Elite]

What I was thinking ( trying to get back on topic lol ) is that they could use a deamon door to travel us back in time, perhaps to a period when the Guild was not destroyed, and we could partake in leveling our hero up - if they wanted to introduce new spells they could have us learn from the the Heros Guilld and take this information back with us to our time, if , for example, they had another enemy like the crawler, except he was only vulnerable to say "divine fury" ( doesnt have to be this only an example ), we could travel back and learn this skill.
This would also help our fable 3 hero to strengthen himself all round, His skills arnt developing while sitting in the throne room, were as our fable 1-2 heros had years of development, from childhood, for their skills, our hero in 3 only had as long as it took to overthrow logan, thats there first time Thereas appeared to him/her and informed our hero of the power they had access to.