Likes, Dislikes, & Improvements

[MudkipLuna]

Hahaha. Yes, they do seem to have a sweet tooth for bad ideas.

No, they cannot defend against flourishes. But not all enemies go flying through the air when you flourish against them, either.

I don't think all enemies should be able to defend against magic, or even many. The only foes that I could see properly defending against it would be the weakest of the *already* naturally weak Hobbes, which is the mage. It would make sense to allow him to pull up a shield for a moment while he summons or casts something.

Magic is a bit different from flourishing, though. They both do great damage, and both require charging for a moment to use, but one only strikes the enemy you are aiming for. And the guy next to him if your lucky, haha. Magic has the ability to hit everything around you and thin out the crowd. So, it is essentially flourishing in all directions. It does not hit everyone, no, but turning a mob into a tea party is no small feat. That said, perhaps it would be best if only half of the spells could be cast at the area, like the ones we have now, but single strike spells doing greater damage. Or you know, something like that. Not to mention, it would really help individualize each spell if they were to be cast differently.

 

[Maverickhey]

None of the enemies can defend against Flourishes or gun shots so I don't see why gimping magic by giving them a defense against it would be a good idea. Aside from that, I agree with most of what you said. It would be nice if they had brought back a lot of the spells from the original game but that would be a good idea and we all know how much Lionhead hates those.

You're in denial dude. Everything has a pro con to it but the ratio is way steeper with other forms of Combat Flourish is unblockable but it is incredibly slow, and does not guarantee a knockdown on some enemies it charges slow, and it 's execution is even slower. Magic though gives a set amount of time of vulnerability you can end a battle quite easily by combining Vortex with something. Some enemies were immune to Vortex in the previous fable I thought that was fair it was not strong enough to pick up alot of the enemies but in this one it is far more limited in it's "immunities". Magic is indeed Magic.. but the AI has many defenses against both Melee, and Range I have on several occassions seen an enemy side strike to dodge a rifle or a sword attack this method does not work on Magic.

 

[MaleficRaven]

You're in denial dude. Everything has a pro con to it but the ratio is way steeper with other forms of Combat Flourish is unblockable but it is incredibly slow, and does not guarantee a knockdown on some enemies it charges slow, and it 's execution is even slower. Magic though gives a set amount of time of vulnerability you can end a battle quit easily by combining Vortex with something. Some enemies were immune to Vortex in the previous fable I thought that was fair it was not strong enough to pick up alot of the enemies but in this one it is far more limited in it's "immunities". Magic is indeed Magic.. but the AI has many defenses against both Melee, and Ranger I have on several occassions seen an enemy side strike to dodge a rifle or a sword attack this method does not work on Magic.

Enemies have zero defense against melee or ranged and how can you sit there and tell me it takes a long time to charge up a Flourish? It takes a second, IF that! The only enemies that can not be knocked down are the very large enemies and well... it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense if you could, now would it? Besides, as a pure caster, I face difficulties fighting them as well. In fact, I can never fully charge up my spells because they've got powerful attacks and some of them are ranged too. You seem to think magic is perfect and there are no flaws to it but have you even bothered using it? And I'm not talking about casting a single spell and then augmenting it with a sword slash or a gun shot, I'm talking about using nothing BUT magic. Because when you combine when form of combat with another, it's obviously going to be more powerful than either of them by themselves.

Hahaha. Yes, they do seem to have a sweet tooth for bad ideas.

No, they cannot defend against flourishes. But not all enemies go flying through the air when you flourish against them, either.

I don't think all enemies should be able to defend against magic, or even many. The only foes that I could see properly defending against it would be the weakest of the *already* naturally weak Hobbes, which is the mage. It would make sense to allow him to pull up a shield for a moment while he summons or casts something.

Magic is a bit different from flourishing, though. They both do great damage, and both require charging for a moment to use, but one only strikes the enemy you are aiming for. And the guy next to him if your lucky, haha. Magic has the ability to hit everything around you and thin out the crowd. So, it is essentially flourishing in all directions. It does not hit everyone, no, but turning a mob into a tea party is no small feat. That said, perhaps it would be best if only half of the spells could be cast at the area, like the ones we have now, but single strike spells doing greater damage. Or you know, something like that. Not to mention, it would really help individualize each spell if they were to be cast differently.

I've already stated that the only enemies incapable of being knocked down are the really big ones which even I have trouble dealing with (as a pure caster).

I heard you the first time and that still wouldn't be fair. Otherwise you need to give enemies resistance against melee and ranged attacks to balance it out. Also, if he gets a shield, I should get a shield since I am technically a mage as well.

Yeah but you can block attacks with a sword, you can't do that with magic. Also, melee and ranged would be ridiculously overpowered if they could hit every enemy at once, not to mention how little sense that would make. How exactly would you propose they change the spells? They seem to be just fine the way they are and if you changed them up, you'd most likely force people to use certain spells and completely neglect others as they would more than likely be useless unless in certain situations.

 

[MudkipLuna]

The first fable did offer a magic shield, actually. So the idea is not all that strange. If we are bringing back real magic and not just using certain cookie-cutter spells in the next installment, there would be no reason not to include a spell that was similar to the old Physical Shield.

I didn't say that we should be able to flourish everyone around us. That would undeniably be overpowered, yes. I just compared it to the magic system which is in place now. A single magic strike is stronger than a flourish, and hitting everyone around you is even more powerful. Magic should indeed be very powerful, but in this game it is the end-all-be-all. A slow time potion fixes any problems one might have with being beat on while charging up, and then everything lies dead or dying at your feet.

Try going through the game strictly using a melee weapon or a rifle and you will see that both of these forms of combat are incredibly weaker than spell casting. These mechanics were designed to be used cooperatively, though, if anyone cares to look at the big picture. If you have problems using only one button, use the others. I cannot hit a far away enemy with a sword, which puts me at a disadvantage. With guns my view is compromised if I aim at a foe, and I am left vulnerable to melee attacks. But with magic I can hit a close enemy, a far enemy, or every enemy within a few yards of me with little effort.

I don't think it should be made less powerful. I just believe magic should be given more depth and require more strategy than what it has been for these past few years.

The only changes I have mentioned would be adding more spells, more spell types, etc. They are not fine the way they are if we not only have a small assortment of spells but each one is basically the exact same thing. The animations are different, but playing through the game and casting different spells, you don't feel any difference at all. There is no reason to create useless spells, but there are many reasons to branch outside of the box that we've been stuck in for the past two games. The reason magic is so fun in the first place is because it is unique, creative, and extraordinary. So, let us be more unique, creative, and extraordinary with our spells. Playing with the elements gets old quick. F1 had a ton of spells, and each was special in its own way. Some were never really used, but most were, and all were appreciated. Even F2 had more spells than this. Zapping everything to death is only one side to spell casting.

 

[Maverickhey]

Enemies have zero defense against melee or ranged and how can you sit there and tell me it takes a long time to charge up a Flourish? It takes a second, IF that! The only enemies that can not be knocked down are the very large enemies and well... it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense if you could, now would it? Besides, as a pure caster, I face difficulties fighting them as well. In fact, I can never fully charge up my spells because they've got powerful attacks and some of them are ranged too. You seem to think magic is perfect and there are no flaws to it but have you even bothered using it? And I'm not talking about casting a single spell and then augmenting it with a sword slash or a gun shot, I'm talking about using nothing BUT magic. Because when you combine when form of combat with another, it's obviously going to be more powerful than either of them by themselves.

it takes after a count of 3.5 seconds to make a viable flourish which these can be blocked. Only the full Charged one or near has this impentrable attack. You have never seen an enemy strafe? Fight a Balverine with only melee go ahead spam X or Flourish to your hearts content, and you will see they have a quite a nifty dodge ability. Seen them do the same with Guns. I may not be a straight Will User but my friend is, and he even admits the game literally easy mode with spells, he debated the game has no challenge then ran through only using Hammer, and flat out admitted that the difficulty increased greatly. I have started using guns on my 2nd play through, and it is easier than melee thats a given but it still has it's challenges you have to straight suck with magic if you have any issues. Now with the bigger enemies ranged classes get even more of an advantge as you avoid one of their heaviest hitting attacks(His AoE Knockback at close combat), cause you roll alot doesnt mean magic is balanced during all fights thats what Range, and Melee have to do all the time.

 

[Maverickhey]

The first fable did offer a magic shield, actually. So the idea is not all that strange. If we are bringing back real magic and not just using certain cookie-cutter spells in the next installment, there would be no reason not to include a spell that was similar to the old Physical Shield.

I didn't say that we should be able to flourish everyone around us. That would undeniably be overpowered, yes. I just compared it to the magic system which is in place now. A single magic strike is stronger than a flourish, and hitting everyone around you is even more powerful. Magic should indeed be very powerful, but in this game it is the end-all-be-all. A slow time potion fixes any problems one might have with being beat on while charging up, and then everything lies dead or dying at your feet.

Try going through the game strictly using a melee weapon or a rifle and you will see that both of these forms of combat are incredibly weaker than spell casting. These mechanics were designed to be used cooperatively, though, if anyone cares to look at the big picture. If you have problems using only one button, use the others. I cannot hit a far away enemy with a sword, which puts me at a disadvantage. With guns my view is compromised if I aim at a foe, and I am left vulnerable to melee attacks. But with magic I can hit a close enemy, a far enemy, or every enemy within a few yards of me with little effort.

I don't think it should be made less powerful. I just believe magic should be given more depth and require more strategy than what it has been for these past few years.

The only changes I have mentioned would be adding more spells, more spell types, etc. They are not fine the way they are if we not only have a small assortment of spells but each one is basically the exact same thing. The animations are different, but playing through the game and casting different spells, you don't feel any difference at all. There is no reason to create useless spells, but there are many reasons to branch outside of the box that we've been stuck in for the past two games. The reason magic is so fun in the first place is because it is unique, creative, and extraordinary. So, let us be more unique, creative, and extraordinary with our spells. Playing with the elements gets old quick. F1 had a ton of spells, and each was special in its own way. Some were never really used, but most were, and all were appreciated. Even F2 had more spells than this. Zapping everything to death is only one side to spell casting.

Exactly, when I say Magic isOP it doesnt mean it needs to be nerfed I suggested enemy defenses to be increased to compensate for the Nuke everything dies in seconds the game is no fun when you dont sport the challenges. Magic has improved in every Fable though certain spells removed which would be cool to have back. But the overall power has increased soo much that the AIs dont stand a chance which makes the magic OP in that sense.

 

[MaleficRaven]

You're preaching to the choir, sister. I already know all of this and I agree with you, I've told people long before Fable III was released how I wish there would be more variety in this game (spell-wise, I mean). However, magic is not the be-all, end-all in this game because if it was, that's the only thing people would use much like with guns in Fable II. Sure, there might be a few people who jumped on the bandwagon when they realized how awesome magic is but there are still plenty of people who use melee and/or ranged weapons and kick a tremendous amount of ass. Also, on my current playthrough, I'm not using any magic and I'm using pistols to augment my blade and I'm doing just fine. I can dodge without losing my spell charge, I don't have to sit there and wait for my spell to power up all the way and overall, it's actually easier than using magic.

I'm not sure if you noticed this but there's a bit of pattern in the three Fable games. In the original, melee weapons were ridiculously overpowered. In the second game, ranged weapons were overpowered. Now in the third game (and I'm not actually admitting this, I'm going off of what you say), magic is overpowered. I imagine it'll either balance out in the fourth and fifth game or it'll repeat itself and since there won't be a sixth game... us casters will get screwed over.

 

[MaleficRaven]

Exactly, when I say Magic isOP it doesnt mean it needs to be nerfed I suggested enemy defenses to be increased to compensate for the Nuke everything dies in seconds the game is no fun when you dont sport the challenges. Magic has improved in every Fable though certain spells removed which would be cool to have back. But the overall power has increased soo much that the AIs dont stand a chance which makes the magic OP in that sense.

Magic is not overpowered and no, the enemies don't need to have their defense increased to compensate for anything. If you honestly believe what you say then don't use magic, no one is forcing you.

it takes after a count of 3.5 seconds to make a viable flourish which these can be blocked. Only the full Charged one or near has this impentrable attack. You have never seen an enemy strafe? Fight a Balverine with only melee go ahead spam X or Flourish to your hearts content, and you will see they have a quite a nifty dodge ability. Seen them do the same with Guns. I may not be a straight Will User but my friend is, and he even admits the game literally easy mode with spells, he debated the game has no challenge then ran through only using Hammer, and flat out admitted that the difficulty increased greatly. I have started using guns on my 2nd play through, and it is easier than melee thats a given but it still has it's challenges you have to straight suck with magic if you have any issues. Now with the bigger enemies ranged classes get even more of an advantge as you avoid one of their heaviest hitting attacks(His AoE Knockback at close combat), cause you roll alot doesnt mean magic is balanced during said fights thats what Range, and Melee have to do all the time.

No it doesn't. It takes me literally a second to build up a Flourish which I can then immediately release and knock an enemy down which allows me to go over and stab him. I can't knock enemies down with spells so I've still got them attacking me while I attack them or while I build up. The enemies can't dodge your bullets and they can't block them either so I'm not exactly sure where you're getting your information. Also, I've never had a problem with enemies dodging my melee attacks. All you have to do is attack them a couple of times until they block then charge up a quick Flourish and bam! They're knocked down and you've opened yourself up for an easy downward stab (which spells instant death for any enemy). I'm using nothing but melee and ranged weapons and it's easy as pie. Sure, I can't just AoE everything to death but as I stated before, that would be silly.

Uh... no. The big enemies are what casters have the most trouble with. They can attack you from a distance and if you just stand there you WILL get knocked out. But hey, if you think you can just fully charge up a spell at a big enemy, be my guest. I think it would be hilarious to see you fight one of those statues in Aurora with the AoE attacks and the ability to summon dark creatures while charging up a level five spell.

 

[MudkipLuna]

I do see the pattern. Haha. Hopefully F4 does balance everything out.. otherwise they may very well just start over again at melee.

You can do well going through this game and not using magic, like you have been doing. Ranged for far away enemies, melee for close ones. But magic can do both, and each spell can do both. That was all I meant to point out. If you are going to focus on ONE form of combat, the easiest one to do it with would be spellcasting.

This has nothing to do with quality of combat, but there are some really cool finishing moves when using a weapon. It's unfortunate that magic kills are always the same. Sure, time slows down sometimes when they die, but magic seems so versatile, I'm sure it would be rather easy to form a few special moves. Not to mention insanely cool.

Anyways, as far as dislikes / etc, I believe I actually left something out. Am I the only person that hated shopping? Stores only had a few items at a time, and stalls only had one. I had to search the entire continent to find a toy doll for my kid, and that is ridiculous. I'm all for having stuff on display instead of scrolling through lists and menus, but not if it is a less efficient way to do things, which it seems to be.

 

[Angel]

The way I see it is this: PM is gradually trying to move away from the RPG genre to a degree and as such has made modifications to try and keep the Fable feel but get rid of some of the traditional RPG clutter. I thoroughly enjoy all the Fable games FOR WHAT THEY ARE because unless it's something game breaking, it's really not worth getting stroppy about. This is precisely why I don't bother with reading/watching anything prior to a game I am looking forward to enjoying because all that happens is you get disappointed because anticipation creates unrealistic expectation and then it just ruins the experience.

Regardless of the time elapsed between games; regardless of Theresa's role; regardless of what is and isn't "canon" I still maintain that Lionhead have made yet another brilliant game with some fantastic acting, dialogue and design. Ok, so there are one or two bugs to iron out - they'll get around to it at some point. Either that or someone will find a way to successfully exploit any glitches to their advantage. But people seem to have had some enormous expectations and are now grousing because they haven't nearly been met - this is typical of a Fable release, it would seem. The hype becomes greater than the finished product and people find lots to complain about.

If it breaks the game, then yes - it needs sorting. But if it's just different and you don't like it, I honestly don't understand what the big problem is. Sure, some things are irritating and I have my own little niggles but ultimately, my avoidance of Fabley info prior to playing the game has thoroughly paid off. I can happily overlook the problems and enjoy the game for what it is.

 

[MaleficRaven]

I do see the pattern. Haha. Hopefully F4 does balance everything out.. otherwise they may very well just start over again at melee.

You can do well going through this game and not using magic, like you have been doing. Ranged for far away enemies, melee for close ones. But magic can do both, and each spell can do both. That was all I meant to point out. If you are going to focus on ONE form of combat, the easiest one to do it with would be spellcasting.

This has nothing to do with quality of combat, but there are some really cool finishing moves when using a weapon. It's unfortunate that magic kills are always the same. Sure, time slows down sometimes when they die, but magic seems so versatile, I'm sure it would be rather easy to form a few special moves. Not to mention insanely cool.

Anyways, as far as dislikes / etc, I believe I actually left something out. Am I the only person that hated shopping? Stores only had a few items at a time, and stalls only had one. I had to search the entire continent to find a toy doll for my kid, and that is ridiculous. I'm all for having stuff on display instead of scrolling through lists and menus, but not if it is a less efficient way to do things, which it seems to be.

Yes, and? As I've told people before, magic has no inherent weaknesses but you can't judge it based on that. It's magic! It has no limitations with the exception of your imagination... and apparently, Lionhead doesn't have a very vivid imagination, haha.

I totally agree with you on that. You should be able to finish your opponents off with style rather than just a wave of flames engulfing your enemies. I can think of a few that would be pretty awesome. For example, lets say you have Shock & Force Push equipped? You could cast Force Push a la DBZ and then as your opponent is flying back you form a Shock lance in your hand and toss it at the enemy, impaling him right in the heart.

 

[Maverickhey]

Magic is not overpowered and no, the enemies don't need to have their defense increased to compensate for anything. If you honestly believe what you say then don't use magic, no one is forcing you.

No it doesn't. It takes me literally a second to build up a Flourish which I can then immediately release and knock an enemy down which allows me to go over and stab him. I can't knock enemies down with spells so I've still got them attacking me while I attack them or while I build up. The enemies can't dodge your bullets and they can't block them either so I'm not exactly sure where you're getting your information. Also, I've never had a problem with enemies dodging my melee attacks. All you have to do is attack them a couple of times until they block then charge up a quick Flourish and bam! They're knocked down and you've opened yourself up for an easy downward stab (which spells instant death for any enemy). I'm using nothing but melee and ranged weapons and it's easy as pie. Sure, I can't just AoE everything to death but as I stated before, that would be silly.

Uh... no. The big enemies are what casters have the most trouble with. They can attack you from a distance and if you just stand there you WILL get knocked out. But hey, if you think you can just fully charge up a spell at a big enemy, be my guest. I think it would be hilarious to see you fight one of those statues in Aurora with the AoE attacks and the ability to summon dark creatures while charging up a level five spell.

There is a miscommunication or you are not reading it properly no a Flourish does not take 1 second not in this world or yours if you have a timer use it. Magic against big enemies as I have stated require rolling just like every class but try getting right up on it's ass, and try to cast.. they will do their power knockback.. you'll know what I am talking about Range has the option to completly null that attack by being at a distance Melee is a hit, and run tactic it doesnt differ much from yours except closing the distance. You need to really read carefully because Ipretty much said this already. But it seems I need to be more exact.

I may want to say also.. I have used this instant kill downward stab maybe 3 times? Playing Fable 3. If I was a potion hog I could do it way more often but it seems really stupid to try, and do it every time.. you will die playing like that or eat recovery items constantly.

 

[MaleficRaven]

There is a miscommunication or you are not reading it properly no a Flourish does not take 1 second not in this world or yours if you have a timer use it. Magic against big enemies as I have stated require rolling just like every class but try getting right up on it's ass, and try to cast.. they will do their power knockback.. you'll know what I am talking about Range has the option to completly null that attack by being at a distance Melee is a hit, and run tactic it doesnt differ much from yours except closing the distance. You need to really read carefully because I did say this already.

No, I'm reading everything you say perfectly, you're just being incredibly ignorant. I've been using melee a lot on my current playthrough and it takes me a second to charge up a Flourish. Either you're doing something wrong or you're just denying facts to make yourself seem credible. The big enemies are just as easy to take down with melee as they are with guns and magic.

 

[Maverickhey]

No, I'm reading everything you say perfectly, you're just being incredibly ignorant. I've been using melee a lot on my current playthrough and it takes me a second to charge up a Flourish. Either you're doing something wrong or you're just denying facts to make yourself seem credible. The big enemies are just as easy to take down with melee as they are with guns and magic.

Ignorant isn't the word I would use. Stubborn is more like it.. until I see proof that your game world exists in which your attacks are much faster than the others to charge a flourish, you can yack your mouth as much as you want I have my own proof, I am sticking with it even with the debated Timing of the Flourish it does not take a second, maybe in Fable 2 but no.. not 3. It can take 2 sconds for the most basic charge for a flourish but it is over 1 second.

As for the big enemies you cant be reading what I typed cause I have been minimizing the differences between all three Melee/Skill/Will I even commented just because you have to roll during those fights as magic doesnt make all fights balanced cause melee, and range have to do it all the time.

 

[MaleficRaven]

Ignorant isn't the word I would use. Stubborn is more like it.. until I see proof that your game world exists in which your attacks are much faster than the others to charge a flourish, you can yack your mouth as much as you want I have my own proof, I am sticking with it even with the debated Timing of the Flourish it does not take a second, maybe in Fable 2 but no.. not 3. It can take 2 sconds for the most basic charge for a flourish but it is over 1 second.

As for the big enemies you cant be reading what I typed cause I have been minimizing the differences between all three Melee/Skill/Will I even commented just because you have to roll during those fights as magic doesnt make all fights balanced cause melee, and range have to do it all the time.

You're right on one part, you're stubborn AND ignorant. You've even gone so far as to state that you refuse to believe anything I say just because you experience it differently. That's basically you saying what I said but refusing to believe anything anyone else says.

This argument is pointless. You're going to keep this repetitive cycle of "It's this way because I said it is!" and that's just going to further derail this thread. If you honestly believe this is worth continuing, you can PM me.

 

[Veryl]

I want pub games to come back! They could even set it up like Red Dead Redemtion where you play other NPC and you can cheat if you want but if you get cought you get evil points.

 

[Angel]

I didn't even notice pub games weren't in this :lol:

I'm so unobservant...

 

[MaleficRaven]

I didn't even notice pub games weren't in this :lol:

I'm so unobservant...

I noticed it and I wasn't too happy with that. I mean, I didn't waste much time playing them but they were a nice break from all the adventuring.

 

[Angel]

I have to admit - it wasn't until today that I realised there were games in the first Fable too...

I don't mind it but perhaps they might bring it back as some DLC or something?

 

[MaleficRaven]

I have to admit - it wasn't until today that I realised there were games in the first Fable too...

I don't mind it but perhaps they might bring it back as some DLC or something?

Hm... doubtful. There wasn't any rumors about it during Fable III's production and I haven't heard anything yet.

I actually earned a great deal of gold right off the bat from the pub games in Fable. Card pairs was my best game and I had a really impressive time too, just wish I could remember what it was.