Question for PC enthusiasts

[TRA Rotid]

Titan anything is just ego-stroking for the biggest of fools with cash to burn, especially when nVidia is just going to come out with another monstrous Titan model soon after. They're glorified cash dumps. Just get a GTX 980 if you're looking to go all Hulk Hogan on your games.

What we really need right now is a solid lock on your true budget here for this rig, because it's going from under $2,000 to well over $4,000 if you're going to be throwing Titans and 6/8-core processing around.

But that's the point.
Seriously though, new GPU architectures are supposed to be around the corner so don't go anything beyond a single 980.
Also recommended was 6-core CPU. Better for the future.
The same is for 16GB of RAM. You won't need it now, but you will soon enough. Might as well stick to 16GB and you won't have to upgrade again next year (or buy completely new sticks all together if you don't manage to find identical ones).

 

[TRA Rotid]

Also that SSD in a previous was supposed to be 512 GB, not MB.

 

[Gikoku]

Also that SSD in a previous was supposed to be 512 GB, not MB.

Yeah I was a little worried about that lol.

I have 3grand to spend. The purpose of my questioning is what is the best bang for my buck I can get.

Gives plenty of breathing room then. I greatly suggest staying away from 6/8-core CPUs and X99 motherboards, they're not necessary right now (nor will they be anytime soon) and you'll end up having to deal with DDR4 RAM only, which is terribly expensive. The performance gain you would receive right now on today's games from that setup would be negligible and you'll be spending a stupid amount for it today when you can get better specs years later at a greater cost cut.

So you'll be just fine with a z97 board (I suggest ASUS brand, MSI isn't that good for overclocking), 16GB DDR3 RAM, a single GTX 980, and an i7-4790k and be able to max every game today without breaking a sweat. As for the power supply I suggest gunning for a Corsair RM850W, comes with a 5 year warranty and has plenty of power to last you many years into the future while offering plenty of room for experimenting (SLI & Overclocking).

All that so far will hit you a bit over $1,350. Which is great so far considering your total budget here of $3,000. All the parts I'm looking at for you right now:

EVGA GTX 980: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814487079
Corsair RM850W: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA1YH1Z12840
Corsair 16GB DDR3: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233246
i7-4790k: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117369
Asus Maximus VII Hero: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132125
(Z97 Pro is great as well, but Hero goes the extra step)

If you drop the GTX 980 down to a 970 it'll bring you to around $1,150.

You can save up on the cash as well if you have any other minor spare parts lying around like keyboard, mouse, cd/dvd drive, 360 wired/XB1 controller, etc.

 

[Zarkes]

Yeah I was a little worried about that lol.


Gives plenty of breathing room then. I greatly suggest staying away from 6/8-core CPUs and X99 motherboards, they're not necessary right now (nor will they be anytime soon) and you'll end up having to deal with DDR4 RAM only, which is terribly expensive. The performance gain you would receive right now on today's games from that setup would be negligible and you'll be spending a stupid amount for it today when you can get better specs years later at a greater cost cut.

So you'll be just fine with a z97 board (I suggest ASUS brand, MSI isn't that good for overclocking), 16GB DDR3 RAM, a single GTX 980, and an i7-4790k and be able to max every game today without breaking a sweat. As for the power supply I suggest gunning for a Corsair RM850W, comes with a 5 year warranty and has plenty of power to last you many years into the future while offering plenty of room for experimenting (SLI & Overclocking).

All that so far will hit you a bit over $1,350. Which is great so far considering your total budget here of $3,000. All the parts I'm looking at for you right now:

EVGA GTX 980: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814487079
Corsair RM850W: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA1YH1Z12840
Corsair 16GB DDR3: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233246
i7-4790k: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117369
Asus Maximus VII Hero: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813132125
(Z97 Pro is great as well, but Hero goes the extra step)

If you drop the GTX 980 down to a 970 it'll bring you to around $1,150.

You can save up on the cash as well if you have any other minor spare parts lying around like keyboard, mouse, cd/dvd drive, 360 wired/XB1 controller, etc.

Excellent, this is perfect I just needed to hear it. You are a very big help to me. Is i7 really necessary over an I5? What is the best way to increase multitasking? Like having multiple applications open at once? What do you think of Solid State Drives? What do you recommend for fans? I'd really like my machine to be quiet. With a 970 in mind, what monitor would you recommend? What towers do you recommend, I need something functional for wire placement. I really don't like most of the popular mid size towers, I'd like to make my own case, is there something I'm missing there because I don't see alot of enthusiasts doing that.

 

[Gikoku]

Excellent, this is perfect I just needed to hear it. You are a very big help to me. Is i7 really necessary over an I5? What is the best way to increase multitasking? Like having multiple applications open at once? What do you think of Solid State Drives? What do you recommend for fans? I'd really like my machine to be quiet. With a 970 in mind, what monitor would you recommend? What towers do you recommend, I need something functional for wire placement. I really don't like most of the popular mid size towers, I'd like to make my own case, is there something I'm missing there because I don't see alot of enthusiasts doing that.

No problem man.

Depends on what you plan to do, if it's strictly for gaming? No. If it's for major multitasking and gaming? Yes. Also, some games out there like Watch Dogs will end up commanding for i7's ability to hyper-thread which will yield really good benefits for it. Best way to improve multitasking: Fast CPU, lotta RAM, SSD, and a 64-bit OS... have those and you'll be faster than greased lightning, so the i7 will better suit you on that front.

SSDs are awesome, just not for gaming. The only benefit you will get from an SSD with games is the performance that comes from retrieving data, i.e. fast loading screens. That's it, no FPS increase. It can also aid in reducing stutter for some games out there that require data retrieval in real time. For operating systems though, everything will be very fast, especially your bootup time. The only downside is the size-to-cost ratio compared to HDDs, but that's expected for next-gen tech.

If you want a dead silent rig, you'll have to opt for liquid-cooling and heatsinks. Otherwise you can have a pretty quiet rig with fans installed (I already do), all you have to do is turn their speed percentage down which can be done via the motherboard's BIOS interface or 3rd-party software like SpeedFan (I usually go for 60% across the board for a good balance of adequate cooling and quietness). As by factory default fans run at 100% speed and sound like a jet turbine in your ear.

I'll have to dig around for some good candidates for monitors, but I would suggest 1920x1080 res honestly. The higher the res you go, the more power you'll need and it'll only take you so far as games continue to get bigger and better. 1080 is easy and pretty, simple as that. Of course, doesn't hurt to have a monitor that can scale anyway just for the sake of freedom.

Again I'll have to dig around for some good candidates or the rest of the guys here can help find a case for you as well. Most don't build their own case because it's cheaper to simply buy one and then customize it to your liking afterwards (lights, cooling, fans, artwork, interactive faceplate interfaces, custom brackets, interior structure, etc). You'd need the know-how and the right equipment to build your own case from scratch, which is something not a lot of people are willing to do (or are even able to). No shame in that. What size are you looking for?

 

[TRA Rotid]

If you want to build a high end machine, you definitely need the i7. The parts Giki listed would give you a high performance, but not necessarily a dream rig for many years (for that you'd need a proper future-proof 6-core CPU, which I'd still recommend if you have the money for it; in fact, I just checked the prices in our local stores and the difference between an i7-4790k and an i7-5820k is only 60 EUR *).
NOW... if you don't plan on overclocking, just roll with the 4-core as it runs on higher stock clock and would actually give you better performance.
Also the 970, while not that far behind the 980, was suggested with the next gen GFXs in mind - in that you run with the cheaper option until they become available. If you don't want to switch, then stick with the 980 I guess, since it's still simply more powerful.
*Ofc RAM and mobo will add a lot to that so it's misleading.

I personally bought the cheapest case (20EUR) I could find and it does it's job... well, did, as my new GPU doesn't fit anymore. Recommended for lower-end towers would be Coolermaster, FractalDesign and Sharknoon, but really it depends on the particular model more than anything.

Since Andy here was already looking for monitors, I got some recommendations here already.
QNIX QX2710 Evolutio
BenQ BL2411PT (cheaper, no G-sync*)
27" Overlord Tempest

*if you got the money a high performance machine would want a G-sync capable monitor. Remember, a good screen will last long after you're going to build a new PC 5 years from now

 

[TRA Rotid]

Will look into these too myself when I get home, still struggling for cash at the moment (have to pay off my trip to Vegas tonight).

Well both the Tempest and QNIX are really expensive ones, one of which I already showed you. The BenQ was slightly over you budget, but should be one hell of a screen so it might be worth it.

 

[Gikoku]

If you want to build a high end machine, you definitely need the i7. The parts Giki listed would give you a high performance, but not necessarily a dream rig for many years (for that you'd need a proper future-proof 6-core CPU, which I'd still recommend if you have the money for it; in fact, I just checked the prices in our local stores and the difference between an i7-4790k and an i7-5820k is only 60 EUR *).
NOW... if you don't plan on overclocking, just roll with the 4-core as it runs on higher stock clock and would actually give you better performance.
Also the 970, while not that far behind the 980, was suggested with the next gen GFXs in mind - in that you run with the cheaper option until they become available. If you don't want to switch, then stick with the 980 I guess, since it's still simply more powerful.
*Ofc RAM and mobo will add a lot to that so it's misleading.

Only because it's redundant after a certain point to be spending for parts like that. That's the problem with PC building, there's no real future-proofing, parts can be obsolete today, tomorrow, or a month/year from now... especially with fresh next-generation tech that's hot on the scene. He could end up spending top-dollar for a 6-core compatible mobo, cpu, and DDR4 RAM.. only for it to be outclassed by cheaper and more reliable parts a year or two later. It's a gamble, I prefer to wait for that new tech to mature and decrease in price from mass adoption, then pull the trigger. During that time he won't be missing anything.

At 1080 gaming, he doesn't need to be going any higher as he won't see much if any performance increase with those specs vs. what I threw up. There's way too many people out there that get caught in the trap of increasing resolution -> increasing hardware. When I built my rig back in 2010, it was of upper-midrange, it's midrange now and still maxes out the games today at 1920x1080.. well, the ones that aren't horribly optimized like Dead Rising 3 anyway... >_>

This is with my parts at stock speed by the way, I haven't even tapped into overclocking yet. He's better off going for those parts now, then upgrading many years down the line. The parts will be cheaper and better by then and most importantly... better tested, early adopters these days have become glorified beta testers for both software & hardware sadly. He's going to be upgrading many years from now regardless, might as well save money while doing it.

 

[Dark Drakan]

Anyone who wants to throw any more monitors into the mix for me to look at can feel free. Paid for my holiday today so going to put cash aside for parts again now so shouldn't be too long until I can sort out the CPU & Monitor and I'm set. Will buy another 8GB RAM a little later as can get that anytime as have bookmarked them on Amazon.

 

[TRA Rotid]

When it comes to this kind of a machine, looking for the best price-performance ratio becomes less important and getting that extra power for some cash is a less rational and more... emotional decision. Unless, of course, it's some ridiculous e-peen stroking case like the Titan X, which a 6 core isn't. With a 3k budget, the additional ~$200 makes little difference. All in all, it is a choice between getting the best optimization in terms of money-power or go the extra step for a real future rig. The performance gains might not be noticeable now, but it surely isn't a pointless cash dump either, because in reality you will never get the absolute top machine if you wait. Fortunately we can predict what's going to happen:
Anything but the GPUs ain't going to spike anytime soon and even if they do, the gain will be marginal, but you'd still have a the top level platform in 2-3 years from now.

So yeah, that's my conclusion.
Either choice is good on an objective level. Depends on what you want.

PS - with Giki's suggested rig, you can drop the mobo and go for Asus Z97-A; costs less.
PSS - Next gen GPUs are supposed to come out in 2 months or so. So wait until then or go with a cheaper 970 if you want to upgrade now.

 

[Zarkes]

I am really liking form factor Pc's and htpc's, they look like consoles. I just wanna do something out of the mainstream river.

I'm noticing alot of boards and other components are optimized for gaming and cost more. What's the difference between a z97 and a z97 GAMER edition??

 

[TRA Rotid]

It obviously depends on the specific models, but I was told that they mainly have different integrated audio and LAN chips. So no difference in performance. More of a marketing trick than anything.
Best LGA1150 board is Asus Z97-A.

 

[Dark Drakan]

Been a long road but my final component will be ordered tonight and then my build can start FINALLY! Final specs for my rig are as follows:

Case: Corsair Carbide 200R
Motherboard: Asus Maximus VII Hero
PSU: Corsair RM850 Plus Gold
CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K
GPU: nVidia MSI GTX 970
RAM: Hyper X Fury Black (16GB)
SSD: Crucial CT120M500SSD1 120GB
HD: Western Digital 1TB x 3
Optical Drive: LG 24X DVD Burner
Windows: 7 (will upgrade to Windows 10)​

 

[Quistrix]

Congrats Andy - glad to see the monster is finally coming to life! We want pictures of the finished result. :thumbsup:

 

[Dark Drakan]

Will finish it up when I get back from Vegas and get Steve round to help me out (when he's free).

 

[Gikoku]

Ah **** sake, kept forgetting to reply to this thread. Anyway, it's definitely been one hell of a journey and I'm glad to finally welcome you back to the glorious PC mustard race. Which monitor did you end up going for?

 

[Dark Drakan]

Ah **** sake, kept forgetting to reply to this thread. Anyway, it's definitely been one hell of a journey and I'm glad to finally welcome you back to the glorious PC mustard race. Which monitor did you end up going for?

One of the BenQ ones Steve recommended to me (forget which model off top of my head), not purchased yet but will do that when I get back. Spent over £2000 in last few days on various car parts, presents for birthdays, some house improvements as well as changing cash for Vegas, so going to let bank refill until I come back then order it. For the price and based on reviews it seems a really good monitor & didnt have many other suggestions that were worth the price differences.

 

[TRA Rotid]

Stagnation continues as AMD's new Fiji chip failed miserably. Nvidia feels no pressure to release new stuff without competition. If they would, they'd probably dominate the market too much, leading into an unwanted monopoly position.
Aka no luck for another year.

 

[Gikoku]

One of the BenQ ones Steve recommended to me (forget which model off top of my head), not purchased yet but will do that when I get back. Spent over £2000 in last few days on various car parts, presents for birthdays, some house improvements as well as changing cash for Vegas, so going to let bank refill until I come back then order it. For the price and based on reviews it seems a really good monitor & didnt have many other suggestions that were worth the price differences.

Nice, can't wait to finally see the whole thing all put together. My friend request for you on Steam has been pending for over a year now, so yeah. >.>

Stagnation continues as AMD's new Fiji chip failed miserably. Nvidia feels no pressure to release new stuff without competition. If they would, they'd probably dominate the market too much, leading into an unwanted monopoly position.
Aka no luck for another year.

It was found out those reviewers were using outdated drivers for the Fury X, and after updating yielded better results where it was neck n neck with the Titan X & 980ti if not better, especially at 4k resolution.

Benchmarks with latest drivers:

Spoiler

The Fiji chip is fine.

Nvidia is already in an unwanted monopoly position and dominates the market. The shady crap nvidia's been doing very lately is stomach turning and has completely made me lose respect for them, the fact they dominate the market so much is what allows them to get away with it too. Their Gameworks tech has been a repeated failure thus far (even a Titan X struggles with it... how?..) and their recent fiasco with Batman Arkham Knight only made things worse.

Case in point: SSAO & Rain textures do not work for Batman on PC regardless of setup, Nvidia Gameworks is poorly optimized along with the game and can not run at 60fps without collapsing on itself thus the game is force-capped at 30fps. But hey, that didn't stop nvidia from falsely advertising their tech and altering gameplay footage by speeding it up to look like 60fps with "working" SSAO & Rain textures. Communities are blowing up over it too (even the youtube page of this video).

Complete with sped up chipmunk screams for enemy thugs starting @0:24. -_-

Honestly, I'm done with nvidia. My next build will be AMD/Intel based now and I'll be looking at the R9 series. Nvidia's main driving argument is power and gameworks, but their own developed gameworks technology doesn't even work on their own damn hardware. Why should I pay for that? At least AMD is open-source, their CPUs may be forgettable, but their cards are still pretty damn good. Sorry for the rant, just really had to get that out.

 

[Dark Drakan]

Nice, can't wait to finally see the whole thing all put together. My friend request for you on Steam has been pending for over a year now, so yeah. >.>

I believe I accepted it a couple of days ago while I was on the Steam sales on my phone. :lol: