Smoking Banned?

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Triz, he was just thanking Andy, something that doesn't seem to happen often enough around here
I wouldn't call that Spam, exactly, and we should try to show patience with new members, not just yell at them :hmm:

Your right Hex. Sorry DuckY.

 

[Arseface]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Well think about it, it helps calm nevors and it be harder for kids to get them.

Morphine does the same thing and doesn't contribute to lung cancer, as do a thousand other drugs.

Smoking has not been banned because we've been doing it since the middle ages, and people had tragically short lives then anyway. Back then there was no way to judge the harmful side effects like there is today. Even during the early 20th century there was little evidence to that aswell. That is why governments decided to tax them instead of ban them. Now that we know the effects, the governments are saying "Don't smoke this!" on the surface, when in truth they are supporting their production and sale.

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Morphine does the same thing and doesn't contribute to lung cancer, as do a thousand other drugs.

Smoking has not been banned because we've been doing it since the middle ages, and people had tragically short lives then anyway. Back then there was no way to judge the harmful side effects like there is today. Even during the early 20th century there was little evidence to that aswell. That is why governments decided to tax them instead of ban them. Now that we know the effects, the governments are saying "Don't smoke this!" on the surface, when in truth they are supporting their production and sale.

True. Why was smoking even intend to USA then?

 

[Angel]

Re: Smoking Banned?

What do you mean? Do you mean why was smoking intoduced to the USA?

In England it could have gone a different way - we could be having tobacco fries whilst we smoke a potato

 

[Tsuyu]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Morphine does the same thing and doesn't contribute to lung cancer, as do a thousand other drugs.

Smoking has not been banned because we've been doing it since the middle ages, and people had tragically short lives then anyway. Back then there was no way to judge the harmful side effects like there is today. Even during the early 20th century there was little evidence to that aswell. That is why governments decided to tax them instead of ban them. Now that we know the effects, the governments are saying "Don't smoke this!" on the surface, when in truth they are supporting their production and sale.

Truth is - it could be banned. Easily. But it won't because it is all about the money, and cigarettes sure does bring in alot of it.

 

[Hexadecimal]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Truth is - it could be banned. Easily. But it won't because it is all about the money, and cigarettes sure does bring in alot of it.

well I wouldn't say it could be banned easily...
Prohibition tends to only drive things underground and they remain just as available as before, and with tobacco being addictive, people will have a strong drive to obtain it by any means necessesary and criminal organizations will have a strong incentive to get into the tobacco bootleg buisiness...
plus the fact that in N.A., Aboriginals have the Right to make, smoke and sell their own cigarettes which can't just be taken away and you'd just end up with everyone running off to the reserves to buy smokes

 

[Tsuyu]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Banning things have never been hard. Keeping the ban enforced however, as you say, is. But that aside, if it weren't for the power and money of the industry a ban could be put in place without much effort.

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

What do you mean? Do you mean why was smoking intoduced to the USA?

In England it could have gone a different way - we could be having tobacco fries whilst we smoke a potato

Well, it came from South. That time it was owned by.. I think Spain or Germany. Anyways, they took it all over there. The people in Germany or Spain, they taught how to smoke them. When the sailors got back, they need more of what was now addicting. They taught the labors in the south how to smoke. There also gotta be Indians here in the South too. But, who taught the Spaniards, (or Germany people) How to smoke is the finger that I point at.

 

[Hexadecimal]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Well, it came from South. That time it was owned by.. I think Spain or Germany. Anyways, they took it all over there. The people in Germany or Spain, they taught how to smoke them. When the sailors got back, they need more of what was now addicting. They taught the labors in the south how to smoke. There also gotta be Indians here in the South too. But, who taught the Spaniards, (or Germany people) How to smoke is the finger that I point at.

umm... no...
tobacco has been growing in North America for around the last 8,000 years... and the Aboriginals living here have been smoking it for around 4,000 years...

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

umm... no...
tobacco has been growing in North America for around the last 8,000 years... and the Aboriginals living here have been smoking it for around 4,000 years...

South= Southen North America
Aboriginals= some Indains
So the Aboriginals are to blame? I mean, who's bright idea was it to let the tobacco free for who every wants it?

 

[Hexadecimal]

Re: Smoking Banned?

South= Southen North America
Aboriginals= some Indains
So the Aboriginals are to blame? I mean, who's bright idea was it to let the tobacco free for who every wants it?

so first of all, Spain and Germany have nothing to do with it as they didn't exist when tobacco began being grown, was my first point :hmm:
and second of all, there is no blame, and I don't see why you need to blame people
tobacco is just a plant, like any other
the Aboriginals, or First Nations people (they aren't from India ), smoked tobacco for different reasons than we do, but other cultures began to appropriate it for the ability to make profit

really don't get what you mean by "free for everyone wants it" :wacko:
it's a plant
plants all start out as free for everyone
it's when people start appropriating them and charging profits for them that they stop being free =]

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

so first of all, Spain and Germany have nothing to do with it as they didn't exist when tobacco began being grown, was my first point :hmm:
and second of all, there is no blame, and I don't see why you need to blame people
tobacco is just a plant, like any other
the Aboriginals, or First Nations people (they aren't from India ), smoked tobacco for different reasons than we do, but other cultures began to appropriate it for the ability to make profit

really don't get what you mean by "free for everyone wants it" :wacko:
it's a plant
plants all start out as free for everyone
it's when people start appropriating them and charging profits for them that they stop being free =]

...... I thought the Aboriginals were decesnds from the Indains?? If tobacco has been around for that long, then that was the time were Mexico was New Spain. New Spain alone was going to be a new continent because it took almost all of Texas and some of Colorado and it is Mexico as well. Old Spain (Spain today) said," Here is free land for the Spainish!". While people from New Spain (Indains) had children with Old Spain people (Spainsh), Indains were workers. The people from Old Spain said," If you wanna make money to support your new families, then you can help devlier some goods over here in Old Spain!". So they did. New Spain started to fall apart.... Then the war came and Mexico lost a lot of land. Now the children (that are Maynes) need work. Old Spain is just Spain again. While this is going on, the people of Spain have tobacco and they also have tobacco in the South of Amercia. But, it still wasn't America yet. The war against Teaxas and Mexico was around 1759.. I think. America had independace in 1776. Just think about it...

 

[Sunshine Acid]

Re: Smoking Banned?

hmmm just banned indoors here, started with bars and such. People complained... "Geez wouldn't want to breathe in unhealthy smoke while I down my alcohol." Give me a break. Plus whenever a non-smoker gets lung cancer everyone immediatly cries and raves that it was second-hand smoke.. first of all that can't be proven, and second of all what about enviornmental factors and other ways? Blaming it on second hand smoke and declaring that as the cause of it is just a short cut and dodging the much needed research we need to find out real answers.

 

[Walker]

Re: Smoking Banned?

sense of smell?

and sorry, but while you are indeed picking up tiny bits of the matter when you smell, substances also change fundamentally when burned...
what you are smelling is not the smoke, but the smell of the burnt cigarette, and it's not the same... the chemicals are released when the cigarette oxideizes for one thing, and it's already burned, that's why you're smelling it...
just trust me, you cannot get cancer from sitting next to a guy who smells like smoke :hmm:

and babies are worse than garlic... garlic is delicious, but eat a baby and all of a sudden everyone is all up in your grill with the cries of "murder" and "atrocities"

Would you rather I had said "olfactory sense?" I could have, I just thought it sounded somewhat pretentious/obnoxious.

Perhaps. On the other hand, neither of us have any expertise in this, so while this isn't the blind leading the blind it is the essentially ignorant arguing with the ignorant and/or un-specialized-in-this-stuff. This is my subtle way of saying we drop this argument. We'll probably keep disagreeing anyway. Hell, you could be right. Easily.

I heard that you can get cancer by eating carcinogens (which is what gets made when something is burnt, if I'm not mistaken, which I probably am). I am probably wrong though...

Nah, "carcinogens" just means "things that cause cancer." "Carcinogenic" means "causes cancer," and so on. The word doesn't mandate burning.

Well think about it, it helps calm nevors and it be harder for kids to get them.

Well, from what I remember of health class and assorted random readings, nicotine (the drug part of tobacco) is a stimulant, which means that, really, it doesn't calm anything. True, smoking might settle cravings for nicotine and feel like it's calming, but really it's not.

True. Why was smoking even intend to USA then?

Long story short, tobacco was largely popular in the US because-- A) It made a lot of money; and B) Americans smoked it just like everyone else.

Maryland, Virginia, and North Carolina were HUGE growers of tobacco. Maryland's whole Proprietary/Colonial economy was built on tobacco. The way cotton was king in the deep south, tobacco was here. EVERYONE grew it. Even if there had been some conception of the dangers, for the longest time Maryland and other states would have been ****ED if it had been banned. For awhile it wasn't just our cash crop-- it was our currency (yes, that was early. 17- early 18th century. Before the US).

Slight explanation of my anti-smoking-ness:

Just to explain why I'm so set against it-- blame it on my dad. He smoked, some time before I was born. He quit when his mom, who also smoked, died of lung cancer. He is REALLY anti-smoking, and where I got my "let's ban it!/it's evil" views.

 

[Hexadecimal]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Would you rather I had said "olfactory sense?" I could have, I just thought it sounded somewhat pretentious/obnoxious.

Perhaps. On the other hand, neither of us have any expertise in this, so while this isn't the blind leading the blind it is the essentially ignorant arguing with the ignorant and/or un-specialized-in-this-stuff. This is my subtle way of saying we drop this argument. We'll probably keep disagreeing anyway. Hell, you could be right. Easily.

no, I would have rather you said "smell"

and I'm not "essentially ignorant" on this subject, just because you are does not mean you can attribute that to everyone else... the fact that substances change when burned is just chemistry, of which I am not ignorant, and having run several harm reduction programs on the topics of smoking, alcohol and narcotics I am not ignorant from that angle either...

you can believe whatever you want, I don't really care :hmm:

 

[Sunshine Acid]

Re: Smoking Banned?

I think the diets of different cultures have as much to do with health issues and cancer as tobacco does. Just take a look at all of the ingredients in all that soda and junk food we all love to eat and drink.

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

I think the diets of different cultures have as much to do with health issues and cancer as tobacco does. Just take a look at all of the ingredients in all that soda and junk food we all love to eat and drink.

Yea, but doesn't cause a addicting crave for it. You eat it sometimes and sometimes you don't. Smoking has to be more dangerous because it's addicting.

 

[Tsuyu]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Yea, but doesn't cause a addicting crave for it. You eat it sometimes and sometimes you don't. Smoking has to be more dangerous because it's addicting.

Not entirely true my friend. Whilst not as addictive as cigarettes, when we eat something we like, our brain releases a "happy substance!" which's-name-escapes-me-right-now. So when you get that "God I'm aching for some chocolate..."-feeling it might just be you subconsciously wanting more of that "happy substance"... :ninja:

 

[Hexadecimal]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Yea, but doesn't cause a addicting crave for it. You eat it sometimes and sometimes you don't. Smoking has to be more dangerous because it's addicting.

actually a lot of people have become psychologically addicted to food... it's a big cause of obesity
people treat food as love and start eating when they want someone to love them but nobody will cause they're too fat... so they just get fatter and fatter eating their love...
what could be more addictive than love? :wub:

 

[Triz]

Re: Smoking Banned?

Not entirely true my friend. Whilst not as addictive as cigarettes, when we eat something we like, our brain releases a "happy substance!" which's-name-escapes-me-right-now. So when you get that "God I'm aching for some chocolate..."-feeling it might just be you subconsciously wanting more of that "happy substance"... :ninja:

... I never had that feeling before. But it can be stop! Just like smoking can be helped, but smoking does way more damage than food. Food you can take a few threapy classes that helps. If you have a smoking problem then it's harder to stop.